Good morning to my Tribe of Sewing Friends!
I wanted to share my experience with altering Vogue 9153, a Marcy Tilton pattern, to fit (or not fit, in the end). While I didn’t end up with a final garment that I am in love with, I thought you might be interested in my fitting process as a follow-up to my post on alterations for my aging body.
I have been sewing for more than 50 years, so I have a series of alterations I know I usually need. But, alterations are trial and error. Muslins are made and wadded in the name of good fit! I cannot tell you how many failures I have had in my sewing lifetime. Sewing is just practice. It may not be so cut and dried for you if you are a newer sewist.
This blouse I spotted via Pinterest served as my inspiration. I have been looking for just the right shirt pattern and this Marcy Tilton pattern is it. The pattern, Vogue 9153, is described as a “loose-fitting button-down shirt has collar variations, mock-front button band, side-front seam with casing, tie, buttoned mock-pocket, left-side darts (stitched on right side of fabric), shaped hemline, front longer than back, wrong side shows, and stitched bias hem facing.” I rarely sew patterns from the “Big 4.” They are really a problem for me to fit properly and can be a lot of work! The sizing is not terribly consistent. But, the fact that I was willing to give this a go speaks to just how much I wanted this pattern to fit!
However, I only like the left side of the pattern. I like asymmetry but, to me, the left and right side of this pattern do not go together. This is only my opinion only but since I will be the one wearing the shirt I guess it is the only one that counts! I want a shirt pattern that can be changed in many ways and look different each time. I don’t want to do all of the fitting work to only use the pattern once.
Choosing a Size
The bust measurements for the pattern range from 29 1/2″ to 48″. What size should I choose? My measurements are 44”-41”-48”.
The finished garment measurements for each size are listed on the pattern pieces. The only one I think I need to consider in choosing a size is the bust measurement. The bottom of the shirt is very relaxed and there should be room for my ample backside. I chose to start with the Large (16-18), which has a finished bust measurement of 46 1/2″. I plan to do a ¾” FBA for my D cup to will increase the measurement at the bust by 1 1/2″, giving me 48″ across the bust and 4″ of ease. Since FBAs are well-documented on the CSC, I will not walk through that alteration.
Tissue Fit
After choosing a size, my first step was a quick tissue fit. Not a complicated tissue fit, but just to see if there were any obvious problems on the front of the pattern.
The first problem I saw is that the neckline is too high! This shirt will cut off my airway! As expected, my forward head alteration was needed: I also saw from my tissue fit that a forward arm alteration was necessary. I was quite happy with the length, though! I have had to add length to the 2 other Marcy Tilton patterns I have made in the past, but I didn’t on this one.
Neckline Alteration
This is the upper front alteration I used:
I wanted to drop the front neckline by 5/8″ without changing the shape of the neckline. I did not want to alter the collar. So, I drew in the 5/8″ seam allowances and then drew in the lines, always parallel or at 90 degrees to the grain line. I cut along them much like a FBA, leaving pivot points.
I dropped the front at the neckline by 5/8″. I drew in the line to keep it straight.
Then I taped it all back together and see that I have not changed the neckline at all. You can see that the overlapped area at the top of the pattern, by the neckline, is a place where I often have extra fabric on a RTW shirt. This alteration is from the wonderful book described in my post on alterations for my aging body.
Oh, I almost forgot to check the front facing, it will have to be changed as the top of the pattern was shortened by 5/8 with my forward head adjustment! I just cut the 5/8 off at the top of the facing!
Forward Arm Alteration
Looking at my tissue fit I saw that the armscye is just WRONG for my forward arm. I have always been stumped by this and it took a trip to Carmel Beach to a Loes Hinse workshop to discover how to fix this. I have never seen this alteration in print. There may be a professional pattern maker out there who will cringe! I use it because it works for me. The place where the problem is under my ring finger! My front chest is at least 1″ narrower than the pattern at this point. The shoulder is not bad.
Now, how I fixed the armscye: I took 1″ out right at the notch on the front arm, and taper to nothing at the neckline and under arm. I used my French curve to get a nice smooth line.
You can see that I have not changed the shoulder or the underarm. Now, I put the amount I cut off onto the front of the sleeve. The notch is where the full 1″ was added. Now the front of the sleeve looks pretty close to the XXL and the shape of the sleeve head has changed to be longer and sloping at the back, with a big upward hill at the front. That is what fits my body.
So in the end, I have less fabric in the front armhole area, and a bigger armscye. And I added extra fabric on the front sleeve to equal the amount taken out.
Full Arm Adjustment
The sleeve bicep measurement is 16 1/2″ on the L. This is on the edge of too tight for me, so I added about 1/2″ to the side seams for comfort. I think I can just ease the extra into the armscye. This is a lazy woman’s BAA (beefy arm adjustment).
Back Alterations
Now the back of the pattern. This is a pattern for a woven, so I know I have to fix the back!
Again, I just use the left back pattern piece. I put in a center back seam so I can fine tune the back alterations and accommodate my rounded and enlarged back. I do a 3/8″ alteration to the mid-upper back and another on the upper back, adding a dart at the shoulder seam. This addition is 5/8″. I also rounded the center back seam to follow my spine curvature. This gives me a 1″ longer back length. I should not need a sway back adjustment because of the trapeze shape at the bottom.
Fit Insurance
This pattern has hip darts that are not for fit but for funky styling. I chose to ignore them and just straightened out the side seams. I also added 1/2″ extra when cutting out the side seams, for fit insurance. It could mean the difference between a muslin that is wearable and one that is a wadder!
Muslin
Now that I have made my changes to the pattern, I sew a muslin to see how it turns out. I am pretty happy with where the neckline and darts are sitting with just the shoulders basted! The armscye looks pretty good!
I am pretty pleased with the back seam. I may take out a tiny bit of curve later as I finesse the fit! You can really see the curvature of my spine and you can sure see my forward head in this picture.
The front: I finished the collar and front facings. I basted the side seams at 1″, so I did not need the fit insurance. I’m liking the position of the front armscye and the darts are pretty good. I might take a bit of trapeze shaping out in the front only.
But, I am not loving that round shape around the bum. I will think about that on the next one.
Ok, let’s get the sleeves in and get her done.
I don’t think you can see that the shoulder seam is centered properly at the neck, but then, instead of going straight towards the ball of my shoulder, it goes toward the back, pulling my sleeve towards the back and making some sleeve wrinkles. How can I fix this for the next shirt? My favorite fix is in this Louise Cutting video. She shows 2 slightly different fixes. I will plan to use the second one.
Conclusion: A Wadder
You know, now that I have this pattern almost fitting well, I don’t like it much. The shirt is too trapeze-shaped and too long in the front. The front is longer than the back and I don’t like the round frame around my bum! I could finesse the side seams by taking them in and I could pick out the front facings and shorten it to make a wearable garment. I could change the back for the next one. But do I want to waste button holes and buttons on a shirt I don’t care for? The sleeves can’t be fixed on this muslin; I don’t have extra fabric.
I may just chalk this up to a learning experience and let this one go! Sigh! I so wanted this to work. I usually just quietly wad my failures, but now you know, too.
excellent pictures and explination
Thanks everyone for allowing me to vent a bit on this forum! Up until now I have only ever posted on this forum my favorite patterns. It took me awhile to figure out that we also have to discuss our failures to figure this fit stuff out.
You are a really great bunch!
You’re right, Elaine! That’s what I like about blogging, documenting the wins and the failures!
Thank you so much for this wonderful post. I have this beast on my table right now and I have the same thing going on with the front armscye. We are almost body doubles! I just finished off Marcy Tilton’s V9089 and found the same issues with it as well but couldn’t find any info how to adjust, so I’m going to give your method a go. As for the “peek a bottom” I guess I’ll just brace myself and look. I may be making another Liberty shirt just to lick my wounds and anticipate the reveal of the Blank Slate Novelista.
I don’t think this is a Marcy problem. I think it is a vogue sloper problem! Licking your wounds with a shirt that fits great is the answer! The Novelista is now a TNT.
As well as my Liberty! Did you ever see the 2 Liberty posts i did here? One on the shirt and one about making it into a T!
I have a new one on the go right now. Updates to follow! I have never found another way to deal with the front armcye! Not even in my wonderful book. They have smaller tweaks that would help in the normal course of events I think BUT combine a bad sloper with my forward arm and it is a disaster in the making. There are so many good patterns out there we just all have to get together and find them!
We will have to start a club! LOL
The beast is now UNDER my table sigh….Funny, because the point where I tossed it was trying to do the burrito method to the collar stand and I totally fubar’ed it. I guess it wasn’t meant to be. Anyway, yes I absolutely did see your lovely Libertys, In fact, your version was one of the ones that convinced me to make it initially! I think you may be right about the Vogue sloper, as I find Marcy’s patterns generally to be so well drafted in the way that they go together so precisely. I think next time I attempt one I will use the shoulders and armscye from a tnt and see where it goes.
LOL! I know how you feel!
Thank you for this. It really does stink to put in all that excellent thinking and work and end up with a wadder, but I truly appreciate your sharing this process, cause it’s what most of us should be doing to begin with.
Start with a TNT and just extend the fronts to points? Add the stuff you want to something you have that already has your necessary alterations. And ….I have that pattern, and never looked at the bum. Oh dear god no.
Thank you for sharing your experience with this pattern. I have been feeling drawn to it for some reason but have felt doubtful that the design would work for me. You have convinced me that it will not and spared me a wadder. Thank you for sharing.
Thanks for sharing your process. Not many makers are willing to share wadders, but I am so inspired by your post to keep working hard when the fitting seems arduous. I really appreciate this reminder that it’s ok to let it go at a certain point. Looking forward to your next post!
My personal rule of thumb is no more than two true muslins.The first muslin should identify if I need to change pattern sizes and any other major fit issues. Usually, I’m good to go after one muslin. But if I’m making major changes, I’ll do a second muslin to make sure that I’m on the right track. If I’m not ready to cut into decent fabric after two muslins, the pattern goes into the bin. I don’t have time for patterns that require major re-drafting for my body in order to get something wearable.
Michelle, I would continue to work on this pattern if I really felt it was special in some way. I think with the shoulder tweak, changing the back, shortening the front, I could get a decent shirt. But I don’t really like it any more. Sigh, I am fickle!
Good rule Michelle. Multiple muslining tends to drain all sewing ambition.
I, too, am an older sewer who has to alter patterns. When the garment is not what I had hoped for, I always finish it and donate it to a women’s shelter. There is always someone who is happy to get the garment.
Thank you for sharing your experience with this pattern. My measurements are VERY similar to yours (I’m 61 years) and I too have to make SO many adjustments to patterns that I really don’t want to just use them once. I just had a frustrating experience with an Indie pattern that I was just in love with but there was no way I could get the darts to work for my D bust. I also often look at Tilton patterns – some work but many don’t once you try them on. They look great on the model on the front of the pattern cover but once made they just aren’t flattering!
Watch here Kathleen as I am booked in with another review later this month with an Indie shirt pattern that did work well. I am wearing my muslin today actually. Again a much better pattern for me!
A quick picture of the new shirt pattern muslin!
Ooooh, this is a lovely shirt. Can you tell me which pattern it is, please? I, too, have been sewing for over 50 years and no longer fit patterns straight out of the envelope. Your detailed post is very useful to me. Thanks! :o)
It is a Novelista shirt by Blank Slate patterns
Thanks! I’m off to investigate! :o)
Hi Elaine
Thank you! Actually I love the style of this shirt! It’s also afforded lots of opportunity for sizing adjustments. Love it!
Your process is admirable. I often wish I had the knowledge and patience to work through fitting issues. I’m learning that some styles I just cannot wear, no matter how many alterations I do. Even if I come close, it still doesn’t look like the picture–different fabric, different size, different model. Most of the patterns I’ve purchased was because of the details. Now, if I see a pattern with style details that I really like, I pull out my sloper that closely matches the style and add the details. It may not be exact, but that’s what originality is all about.
I am usually much more discriminating in my pattern choices. But I fell for the hype of this one. I finally understand that most “Big 4″ patterns are just not for me. There is just too much wrong with the slopers particularly as they grade up into the plus sizes. They seem to think that we get taller and grow bigger shoulders as we get ” fluffier” in certain areas. That is why I am enjoying this explosion of Indy patterns. Once you get a great fitting designer who understands the concept of where weight goes on our bodies you have it nailed. Every time I fall for trying a vogue pattern I end up feeling like there is something wrong with either my body or my sewing skills. And all the joy goes away. And I get a lot of joy from my sewing gift!
How I understand–Vogue Patterns do me in too! And I own so many–woe!
What a wonderful description of process, thank you so much! I’m in your demographic and am starting to sew again, so your posts are extremely valuable to me. If I don’t start sewing again they’ll have to bury me with my stash, and I have some one-owner vintage Abraham and Leonard silks that deserve better. Thanks for the encouragement.
I finally started using my “good fabric” now. No sense waiting until I am thinner, happier or older. I deserve that NOW! My daughter in law will send all my fabrics to Value Village when I die. So I won’t even get a chance to be buried with my Ralph Lauren silk velvet.
After all the pattern work and the muslin I have to agree that this pattern is not flattering at all. I think Marcy patterns only work for a few people and not the general public. By the time we alter everything to hang better and fit better and dare I say flatter the figure, you might as well have drawn the whole thing out yourself. I do all the same alterations that you do to most patterns and they come out fitting well and hanging straight…this poor pattern has way too many issues! After sewing for clients for over 45 years, I can say “step away from this pattern”…ha ha
I think you are right! I have to look for a pattern with ” better bones”. Princess seams and better fit out of the envelope. Then play with style and be adventurous. By the way I am a big fan of your blog!
Great minds think alike…ha ha Love your garment “adventures” and your truthful blog postings!
I really enjoyed reading about this process. Fitting can be such a difficult process and I’m glad you showed us the journey, thank you.
I am enjoying the postings of the changes needed to your patterns. I have THE BOOK and printed out the first posting you wrote and put it in my book. Sewing for my aging body could benefit from these fitting techniques. I look forward to your postings re pattern adjustments. You do a fabulous job of explaining the changes. Thank you
I was liking this shirt, the adjustments, the fit — until we got to the back view. Ugh! That’s a weird hem line, but something that can be changed. The end result did not flatter you. Do you think shoulder pads would give the whole look a lift? It reminds me of my many sewing disasters– close, but not quite. I hate to think this promising pattern can’t work for you with just the right tweaks
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You are right of course, all those adjustments! I have a strong neede to WIN! I haven’t yet decided what I will do. I am quietly working on 2 different patterns at the moment. The first one was a wearable muslin and fits quite well. Just starting the second one. Will update you all! I really need a button down shirt that I can just go-to!
I too have this pattern but, have not had time to tackle it yet. I will be referring to this post when I am ready to start. Thank you for the very helpful tips and points to consider.